33 thoughts on “An Idea to Fix Dead by Daylight's Toxicity Problem”
I disagree that people who are toxic (and they do exist) only play one role.
The most vile people I’ve ever see. Send hate in this game, openly talk massive in the lobby and in private messages, when they are preserving themselves at a disadvantage.
They use all the best perks and have just as many hours or more then there opponents, and they just can’t deal with the fact that sometimes shit doesn’t work out. So they blame the thing that benefits from their loss.
And as the match goes on they become more and more unhinged. Blaming whatever boogeyman they have locked and loaded before the match even hit the pregame lobby as an excuse as to why they are losing.
Imo, people have no patience or tolerance for anything but the best outcome possible for every single game or it shatters their little fragile ego.
These are the same people who ruined games like Left 4 Dead co-op because one team mate accidentally alerts the witch, ruining their random pick up group speed run they told no one about.
The people who ruin playing Dark souls multiplayer by making up their own ruins and codes of honor when it comes to “dueling” but abandon all of that as soon as they think the person they invade has broken their make believe agreement that never took place, then using cheat engine to optimize their build or resupply their ammo/souls for their cheezy fucking meta noob pounding builds.
These are the people who ruin games that are symmetrical in nature like Splatoon, by claiming everyone is cheating, lagging or using broke weapons while using the Meta gun.
They are just absolutely garbage people who tie their own self worth to a video game, and have little to no redeeming quality in this space.
People need to stop coddling these fuck faces and call them the hell out because the more time that people like this spend ruining others fun, they do nothing but recruit more and more people into their asshole army of behavior, while pushing casual fun players out of the space.
I think you are wrong about toxicity coming from people only playing one side. I even would say that the majority of player play both sides. The toxicity comes from the feel of percieved unfainess and it comes out regardless of the role you are playing. For example when someone loads into a game with a weaker killer and with a bad perk build for wathever reasons and goes against survivors with strong builds a sense of unfairness emerges because they feel there is nothing theye can do. As opposed to other games, shooters for example when you get killed by a sniper and you feel that's unfair you can switch weapon/class and get to their level. I DBD there is not such option; once you load into a game and you go against some one that counters you are forced to play that game and get frustrated.
In shooters they might bag you or whatever, but in dbd they can quite literally decide that you don't get to play. Killer just camps hook waiting to tunnel. It isn't hard to stay just outside of the anti camp range, and when another surv goes for the unhook you just approach and tunnel. The optimal choice is for 3 survs to sit on gens the whole game and leave. So there was 1 chase for 1 surv, and other than that there isn't gameplay. Bully squads exist and are annoying to deal with, but realistically for the vast majority of the playerbase they are too focused on bullying and still lose. That at least gives the killer the satisfaction of having won while the survs were being annoying.
First of all, nice video and idea, I really agree with incentivise players to swap roles, it would benefit to everyone and make games feel better in general
First, I would say that toxicity is also a personal feeling thing. I've seen some players going insane bcp of a t-bag, nod after a stun, facecamp, whatever. I mean, a taunt can be frustrating, but not everyone would call this toxicity since it's not really hurting you through slurs or saying that you should d*e right ? I think this is why a part of the playerbase overeact towards dbd real toxicity overall
My second point, could the high toxicity feeling be somehow linked to the mmr ? Like you said, most of the toxic players are either not very good at the game, either one-sided (even if I think that both are linked but that's on me), so they think they do an insane job whereas not really in fact, which end in the end game toxicity where they insult and blame everybody but them. As someone who started dbd one year ago (I have like 1k hour now), I feel like my games are less toxic now that my mmr grew a bit I always get some end game complains, like everyone else, but very rarely insult compared to when I had less than half hours And even when I was clueless about my games, I don't think toxic behaviors happened a lot overall Does anybody agree / disagree ?
As someone who only plays killer i do belive that both sides should have fun but also understand that when they get nerfed in some way that its so the other side can have fun to
DBD has a lot of unwritten rules for both sides that are imposed by the opposing side. Most of the rules are bullshit.
But if you break those rules you're "toxic" and it's open season for post-match complaining and actual toxic behaviours like bleeding out survivors instead of hooking them.
Yeah I think you’re right. Especially with regard to people only playing one side.
When I first got into the game it was like 800 hours of nothing but killer pretty much, and I hated all survivors and basically acted like a Reddit killer.
Then I played survivor and actually got perspective. It matters a lot.
Tunnel camping at 5 gens is toxic, especially when that killer tries to claim that they're skilled when that's all they do. Tribalism aside, there are plenty of players who play this game with the sole intent of making it not fun for the other side. They even go so far as to have it proudly displayed on their profile.
My least favorite people in this community are the ones who say "I play both sides and (absolute dumbest statment imaginable that clearly shows they do not play both sides)" And it's usually survivor only players in my experience I have met very few people who play almost only killer Not saying my anecdote experience makes its true just what I notice
I don't know how delusional you must be to think its not that bad. It insanely bad, I had a few matches where I did poorly got called all the names, I am a noob and a bot, I played a game and won, I got called a sweaty piece of shit and my mother should get cancer (on chaos shuffle so no it was not my build). Its better than before but still its terrible. As for the playing the other side I am not sure it will work because people will just ignore it and still play one side or they will just afk through match and be done in like 4 minutes or so. On the other hand if the reward is locked by performance rating like two kills or X hooks or at least one irredescent badge, even less people will be willing to try as they will see that they can't do it and will not attempt again. Also the problem will be that it would have to be on a high level, otherwise even a first time killer will steamroll the mmr 0 survs and think that its even easier than he/she thought. Its a nice idea but I think it would need to be somewhat polished to account for those options.
I play both sides alot and I gotta say if you face camping as bubba you might not be toxic but you're definitely trying too hard and you're loser regardless of your motives.
The reason people say dbd is so toxic is because the vast majority of the community misuses the word ‘toxic’. Dbd players will call you toxic for using certain perks, items, add ons. You’ll get called toxic for tea bagging or if a killer gives you the nopers after downing you. In my opinion things shouldn’t be called toxic unless they prevent you from playing the game, or if they bleed over outside of the game. Example, if someone traps you at the gate and prevents you from moving to escape, that is true toxicity. Or if someone is messaging you and insulting you in endgame chat, that is toxic. People need to stop using that word as a filler when people do something they don’t like.
I agree with your reasoning. Do you think there's practical incentive that's worth playing the killer if you are playing with friends? I suspect that a lot of people who play only survivors often play with friends. Since solo-q is the worst way to play dbd by far, it also incentivizes people who play alone to only play as killers (or rather it punishes players for playing survivor alone). I think your recommendation + fixing solo q experience would help, and the latter would solve a lot of other problems as well, notably balance.
I can you tell the main reason you pointed out is that people only play one side. The most toxic I've found is survivors that have 1,000 hours and never touched a killer. I can't tell you the amount of times as a red rank 1 killer, I've gone against survivor mains that complain about my style of game play where I will target the one that's on death hook since I have to pressure them. They will be toxic and call me slurs for simply killing someone. It's insane how egocentric people can be and that's the main toxicity of this game.
The problem is that the multiplier would incentivise killer mains to just suicide on hook as survivor for 5 games straight and then use that multiplier for killer to get more bloodpoints, or conversely survivor mains would just play Doctor to farm Deviousness points before going back to their usual role – you can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink. Incentives are a really poor way to solve problems in general, and the game has so many of them already that it's become punishing to play any role that doesn't have any bloodpoint incentives.
No, i dont think it will work. I know because i play both roles 50/50 and i still find people tunelling at 5 gens or survivors tbagging at a baby kiiler to be extremley toxic. And because i played both sides i know what they do its just them being assholes
It's a small complaint but I think having the option to turn off end-game chat would just be handy. I found it odd that you never had the option to just avoid the toxic outbursts players can have sometimes unless they were on another platform.
dbd is really not that toxic lmao, try playing valorant as a female and being threatened with some very unsavoury things and screamed at for 30 minutes straight lol
the dbd community just needs to grow up, i’ve never seen a community cry over teabagging until i started playing this game. i can’t imagine a cod player crying over half of the stuff this community does. you really just have to ignore it and get over it
Honestly out of all the toxic communities I've seen, DBD is far among the lowest. Killers can be really chill and so can survivors FAR more often than ANY League player. Granted, it IS a toxic game, but that's the nature of anything competitive, as you've alluded to. I find the DBD community more whiny than toxic.
I think people’s gameplay style is based off their most powerful experiences and nothing hits harder than a bad experience. I think the best way the game moves forward is to create the ability to extend positive interactions between players. I noticed in DBD mobile that players can gift other players and I think that would be a great incentive for players to treat others better. It would make people feel good to receive BP from others when they do a good job and if they behave toxic then they just don’t get anything and get reported.
I disagree that people who are toxic (and they do exist) only play one role.
The most vile people I’ve ever see. Send hate in this game, openly talk massive in the lobby and in private messages, when they are preserving themselves at a disadvantage.
They use all the best perks and have just as many hours or more then there opponents, and they just can’t deal with the fact that sometimes shit doesn’t work out. So they blame the thing that benefits from their loss.
And as the match goes on they become more and more unhinged. Blaming whatever boogeyman they have locked and loaded before the match even hit the pregame lobby as an excuse as to why they are losing.
Imo, people have no patience or tolerance for anything but the best outcome possible for every single game or it shatters their little fragile ego.
These are the same people who ruined games like Left 4 Dead co-op because one team mate accidentally alerts the witch, ruining their random pick up group speed run they told no one about.
The people who ruin playing Dark souls multiplayer by making up their own ruins and codes of honor when it comes to “dueling” but abandon all of that as soon as they think the person they invade has broken their make believe agreement that never took place, then using cheat engine to optimize their build or resupply their ammo/souls for their cheezy fucking meta noob pounding builds.
These are the people who ruin games that are symmetrical in nature like Splatoon, by claiming everyone is cheating, lagging or using broke weapons while using the Meta gun.
They are just absolutely garbage people who tie their own self worth to a video game, and have little to no redeeming quality in this space.
People need to stop coddling these fuck faces and call them the hell out because the more time that people like this spend ruining others fun, they do nothing but recruit more and more people into their asshole army of behavior, while pushing casual fun players out of the space.
nah survivors are just toxic
I think you are wrong about toxicity coming from people only playing one side. I even would say that the majority of player play both sides.
The toxicity comes from the feel of percieved unfainess and it comes out regardless of the role you are playing. For example when someone loads into a game with a weaker killer and with a bad perk build for wathever reasons and goes against survivors with strong builds a sense of unfairness emerges because they feel there is nothing theye can do. As opposed to other games, shooters for example when you get killed by a sniper and you feel that's unfair you can switch weapon/class and get to their level. I DBD there is not such option; once you load into a game and you go against some one that counters you are forced to play that game and get frustrated.
In shooters they might bag you or whatever, but in dbd they can quite literally decide that you don't get to play. Killer just camps hook waiting to tunnel. It isn't hard to stay just outside of the anti camp range, and when another surv goes for the unhook you just approach and tunnel. The optimal choice is for 3 survs to sit on gens the whole game and leave. So there was 1 chase for 1 surv, and other than that there isn't gameplay. Bully squads exist and are annoying to deal with, but realistically for the vast majority of the playerbase they are too focused on bullying and still lose. That at least gives the killer the satisfaction of having won while the survs were being annoying.
First of all, nice video and idea, I really agree with incentivise players to swap roles, it would benefit to everyone and make games feel better in general
First, I would say that toxicity is also a personal feeling thing.
I've seen some players going insane bcp of a t-bag, nod after a stun, facecamp, whatever. I mean, a taunt can be frustrating, but not everyone would call this toxicity since it's not really hurting you through slurs or saying that you should d*e right ?
I think this is why a part of the playerbase overeact towards dbd real toxicity overall
My second point, could the high toxicity feeling be somehow linked to the mmr ? Like you said, most of the toxic players are either not very good at the game, either one-sided (even if I think that both are linked but that's on me), so they think they do an insane job whereas not really in fact, which end in the end game toxicity where they insult and blame everybody but them.
As someone who started dbd one year ago (I have like 1k hour now), I feel like my games are less toxic now that my mmr grew a bit
I always get some end game complains, like everyone else, but very rarely insult compared to when I had less than half hours
And even when I was clueless about my games, I don't think toxic behaviors happened a lot overall
Does anybody agree / disagree ?
As someone who only plays killer i do belive that both sides should have fun but also understand that when they get nerfed in some way that its so the other side can have fun to
DBD has a lot of unwritten rules for both sides that are imposed by the opposing side. Most of the rules are bullshit.
But if you break those rules you're "toxic" and it's open season for post-match complaining and actual toxic behaviours like bleeding out survivors instead of hooking them.
Yeah I think you’re right. Especially with regard to people only playing one side.
When I first got into the game it was like 800 hours of nothing but killer pretty much, and I hated all survivors and basically acted like a Reddit killer.
Then I played survivor and actually got perspective. It matters a lot.
Tunnel camping at 5 gens is toxic, especially when that killer tries to claim that they're skilled when that's all they do. Tribalism aside, there are plenty of players who play this game with the sole intent of making it not fun for the other side. They even go so far as to have it proudly displayed on their profile.
Imagine how stale and boring dbd would be if it wasnt occasionally toxic though.
My least favorite people in this community are the ones who say "I play both sides and (absolute dumbest statment imaginable that clearly shows they do not play both sides)"
And it's usually survivor only players in my experience
I have met very few people who play almost only killer
Not saying my anecdote experience makes its true just what I notice
Solutition: stop being a little bitch. Its every game ever. Its behaviors issue actually cause the coddle to every little stupid problem
I don't know how delusional you must be to think its not that bad. It insanely bad, I had a few matches where I did poorly got called all the names, I am a noob and a bot, I played a game and won, I got called a sweaty piece of shit and my mother should get cancer (on chaos shuffle so no it was not my build). Its better than before but still its terrible. As for the playing the other side I am not sure it will work because people will just ignore it and still play one side or they will just afk through match and be done in like 4 minutes or so. On the other hand if the reward is locked by performance rating like two kills or X hooks or at least one irredescent badge, even less people will be willing to try as they will see that they can't do it and will not attempt again. Also the problem will be that it would have to be on a high level, otherwise even a first time killer will steamroll the mmr 0 survs and think that its even easier than he/she thought. Its a nice idea but I think it would need to be somewhat polished to account for those options.
I play both sides alot and I gotta say if you face camping as bubba you might not be toxic but you're definitely trying too hard and you're loser regardless of your motives.
you could do what blizzard did and ban/silence anybody for swearing
The reason people say dbd is so toxic is because the vast majority of the community misuses the word ‘toxic’. Dbd players will call you toxic for using certain perks, items, add ons. You’ll get called toxic for tea bagging or if a killer gives you the nopers after downing you. In my opinion things shouldn’t be called toxic unless they prevent you from playing the game, or if they bleed over outside of the game. Example, if someone traps you at the gate and prevents you from moving to escape, that is true toxicity. Or if someone is messaging you and insulting you in endgame chat, that is toxic. People need to stop using that word as a filler when people do something they don’t like.
TFW your two main games are overwatch 2 and DBD. I’m immune for life 😈
Gamers are pretty toxic maaaan
damn, Scott called survivors the n word and said that they should die irl in the end of the video? now that's wild
I agree with your reasoning. Do you think there's practical incentive that's worth playing the killer if you are playing with friends? I suspect that a lot of people who play only survivors often play with friends. Since solo-q is the worst way to play dbd by far, it also incentivizes people who play alone to only play as killers (or rather it punishes players for playing survivor alone). I think your recommendation + fixing solo q experience would help, and the latter would solve a lot of other problems as well, notably balance.
I can you tell the main reason you pointed out is that people only play one side. The most toxic I've found is survivors that have 1,000 hours and never touched a killer. I can't tell you the amount of times as a red rank 1 killer, I've gone against survivor mains that complain about my style of game play where I will target the one that's on death hook since I have to pressure them. They will be toxic and call me slurs for simply killing someone. It's insane how egocentric people can be and that's the main toxicity of this game.
The problem is that the multiplier would incentivise killer mains to just suicide on hook as survivor for 5 games straight and then use that multiplier for killer to get more bloodpoints, or conversely survivor mains would just play Doctor to farm Deviousness points before going back to their usual role – you can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink. Incentives are a really poor way to solve problems in general, and the game has so many of them already that it's become punishing to play any role that doesn't have any bloodpoint incentives.
No, i dont think it will work. I know because i play both roles 50/50 and i still find people tunelling at 5 gens or survivors tbagging at a baby kiiler to be extremley toxic. And because i played both sides i know what they do its just them being assholes
They could make it so grades reward for playing both sides.
Like grade 1 irridenst gives you 1 million but if you play both sides, whatever side is the lowerest rewards you with shards,
So say you're gold 1 and irridenst 1
You get the shards rewards for hitting both sides gold 1 and you get lets say 4000 shards
So if you hit both irridenst on both sides you get a reward of 6000 shards
Scott singlehandedly solving racism
Im a killer main but always was once a survivor main. I think it’s a good idea they need to play both.
It's a small complaint but I think having the option to turn off end-game chat would just be handy. I found it odd that you never had the option to just avoid the toxic outbursts players can have sometimes unless they were on another platform.
dbd is really not that toxic lmao, try playing valorant as a female and being threatened with some very unsavoury things and screamed at for 30 minutes straight lol
Play survivor get tunneled by the killer. Play killer run into a bully squad swf. What does playing the other side do for toxicity? Nothing
I think the asymmetrical aspect plays a huge role into why DBD is viewed as "uniquely toxic"
the dbd community just needs to grow up, i’ve never seen a community cry over teabagging until i started playing this game. i can’t imagine a cod player crying over half of the stuff this community does. you really just have to ignore it and get over it
Honestly out of all the toxic communities I've seen, DBD is far among the lowest. Killers can be really chill and so can survivors FAR more often than ANY League player. Granted, it IS a toxic game, but that's the nature of anything competitive, as you've alluded to. I find the DBD community more whiny than toxic.
I think people’s gameplay style is based off their most powerful experiences and nothing hits harder than a bad experience. I think the best way the game moves forward is to create the ability to extend positive interactions between players. I noticed in DBD mobile that players can gift other players and I think that would be a great incentive for players to treat others better. It would make people feel good to receive BP from others when they do a good job and if they behave toxic then they just don’t get anything and get reported.