Read more Dead by Daylight ➜ https://deadbydaylight.mgn.gg
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Read more Dead by Daylight ➜ https://deadbydaylight.mgn.gg
http://www.twitch.tv/ScottJund
https://discord.gg/TheBreaderhood
source
You gotta remember, the first mistake is playing this game
Whenever I hear that nonsense, I flashback to something I saw on hook while on Ormonds. An Ace got intercepted coming to rescue me on the hook but kited the killer on the hook through the central house, towards me. A single survivor mistake that resulted in him running the killer into both survivors that were coming to rescue me. The killer got 4 hits from the resulting clusterfuck including a down on the Ace plus I hit second stage while being unhooked with no borrowed time basically in front of the Spirit. 4 generators left. Immediate pick-up with no decisive strike, I died.
Is this a reupload?
Scott "Scott Jund" Jund
Everything's fun and games until that one solo-que survivor finishes a gen against the Pig
i do appreciate how you are keeping things unbiased
Bruh mfs are serious about dead by daylight lol
The relative impact of a killer mistake is a function of how coordinated the survivor group is and especially how good their perks are. In typical games, there is probably not a big difference.
You're usually pretty close, but not on this one Scott. First off, your example of a survivor being hooked and a killer chasing the guy coming to unhook isn't even a survivor mistake, it's just normal gameplay. You're trying to equate a good killer creating map pressure as a survivor mistake, so you might as well be saying that two gens popping in the first chase is a killer mistake.
An example of an actual survivor mistake is missing a flashlight or pallet save, or looping around a hooked teammate, or going down near basement, or 3 genning themselves. The only truly game losing survivor mistake is a 3 gen. Killer side though, you're so pressed for time that even a 30 second mistake will lose the game right then and there. So that means chasing in a strong area, or eating a DS, or swinging at a dead hard, or getting hit validated means you lose, thanks for playing, GG EZ.
Now as for the whole "You want killer to have a dead hard or DS" comment… It's easy to make a 1-1 comparison on that, DS or dead hard grants an extra health state, to a possible total of 16 health states, but more reasonably around 10. Killer equivalent to that would be exposed, so it would be like giving killer a perk that starts with 4 tokens, and the first 4 people you attack are instantly downed. Would that be OP as fuck? Absolutely, but it would have similar impact to DS and DH.
End of the day, this game is so survivor sided that killer can play PERFECT, and still lose, so yeah, any killer mistake is much more punishing that survivor.
Survivor can just press e XD
Speaking of 1 survivor mistake ruining the game. I recently had a game in which the team did really well and the killer only had like 2 hooks after all gens done and gates opened, they downed 1 survivor and face camps them me and my friend went in for the save on the them, friend took the hit, but the killer body blocked me so I couldn't save without trading. I traded and then everyone was injured and long story short the killer snowballed into a 2k
I think the better way to say this point is
Survivors have a much easier time recovering from a mistake compared to killer
Dbd streamer killer mains complain too much. Win 20 games then lose 1 cuz u go against an insane swf and survivor is too op 😂
I think survivor mistakes are have a higher range of impactfulness on the game. A survivor ‘mistake’ can range from missing a skill check once to getting grabbed out of a vault 30 seconds into the game. I think most killer mistake are around a middle impact, missing an M1 will lose you some seconds, sometimes more if they get to a loop, going to the wrong gen at least gives you information that that gen isn’t worked on yet, accidentally hitting a borrowed timed survivor still makes them need to mend, etc. The biggest mistake you can make would be chasing someone at a strong loop, and realizing that survivor is very skilled and is wasting a lot of your time, which at that point it’s less of a mistake and more of a bad play.
just want to point out for people, if the things a killer messes up on is more impactful because they are 100% of their team, the reverse must also be true in that the things that the killer does well is more impactful than what an individual survivor does well for the same reason.
I'd say the range of impact for Survivor mistakes is far wider than Killer. Killer mistakes are all fairly medium impact and add up to win or cost them a match. Survivor mistakes range from little impact to instantly losing a match.
If you look at it as the survivor is 1 person and not part of a team then 1 survivor mistake can remove someone from being able to play anymore that match, the killer will never be in that situation where 1 mistake will no longer allow the killer to play
I think one of the biggest problems in terms of having a good understanding of this game is that killers win through macro play, survivors win through micro, and people don’t seem to quite get how much of a difference that makes. Like obviously both sides have micro and macro plays they can make to impact the game, but due to the asymmetry killers win through big picture, like how you mentioned one hook pressuring two or three people rather than just the one. And survivors get to make a whole bunch of independent small decisions (like a good dead hard or w/e) that then build up to win the game, and are much more obviously felt. Everyone immediately understands the difference between dodging a killer at the last second and surviving (even if it is for only 20 seconds, even a new player can feel good) but it takes experience to understand the impact of a swift down and good gen pressure, assuming you’ve even played enough to know what that is.
People think of the asymmetry as a scale, like you press down on one side, but if you pressed down the same on the other side it’d balance out again. I think it’s more like a see-saw. You press down on a side and it kinda just keeps going in that direction until you press on the other side. Hence why even if the overall impact is the same, people will feel that survivors’ unfair bonuses mean more. It’s four people all nudging one side versus a killer’s occasional stronger nudge on the other XD (assuming it’s an “even” game or whatever)
The reason I think killer mistakes are punished much more is because they don't get as much assistance as survivors do when it comes to practically anything in the game. Survivors can make 30 different mistakes in chase and it could still last at least 40 sec just by things like map design (lots of pallets and safe loops), perks, dead hard, windows, lithe, etc, and even other survivors helping with body blocks or flashlight/pallet saves. Map rng could seriously fuck over a killer if they spawn good tiles with lots of loops, but if they get lucky and that doesn't happen then it's just seen as a "normal" map not even killer sided.
Most killer mistakes are really really specific like the Bubba face camping point you brought up, sure their isn't anything that single survivor can do about it but that's it, The Bubba is punished for face camping by losing the game and only getting 1 survivor if the rest of the team does gens, maybe he could get 2 kills but that would be about it. That isn't affecting the rest of the team unless they choose to let it. If I'm solo or with friends and a bubba is hard camping me or someone else I just say oh well and do gens.
Also the thing about chasing the survivor that's going for the save, there is no guarantee that you'll just find that survivor unless you're hovering around the hook meaning you're just gonna lose gens to secure a hook state and or a kill. Most of the time a survivor is already near the hook ready for the save as someone gets downed but they are hiding and waiting for you to leave and if they're on comms this works even better because they can ask for help if they really need it. Even if this is how you play throughout the match you'll most likely lose if the team is pretty average, simply because chases will almost always be more than 30 sec (if they're average or better) also the time it takes to walk to hooks and other things, you'd have to hook all the survivors a crazy amount of times for this to happen enough for you to win, and you'd somehow have to stop the gens from being done.
Survivor mistakes do impact the team as a whole, but they are a lot less likely to be in a position to make a mistake based on how the game is designed and how survivor perks and even things like insta heals, flashlights, and other survivor add ons. This is why when they do make mistakes it hardly matters. Killer mistakes can cost them the game because most of them don't have things to set them on equal ground. An example would be if a survivor messed up the loop at shack, they can just dead hard to the pallet and now they're safe again, but if for say a Blight used his power and made a mistake he now has to be slowed whilst waiting x amount of time to get his power back allowing the survivor to gain distance, the same goes for many killers like bubba, spirit, nurse, billy huntress, slinger, etc. The punishment for killer is much more often to occur than survivors since it's so much easier for them to make mistakes, unlike survivors who consistently make mistakes but get assistance from almost everything in the game. Wraith spends 40 sec chasing you and only gets a hit because you made a mistake so he decides to leave, well now you just heal in 8 sec and do a gen, but if wraith makes a mistake and gets caught on a wall, misses a swing, or anything else he gets stunned by a pallet and loses 2 or 3 gens.
I completely agree i think the people who say that killer mistakes are punished more just feel like the survivor didnt do anything and then when a survivor makes a mistake the killer still has to find that one person chase etc not my view on it but one i think some people would have
I was trying to think about mistakes during phases of the game. I feel like the earlier the game is the more significant survivor mistakes are and as time goes on, killer mistakes become more detrimental. If you can get your first down before a gen pops then that's a gen that gets popped or suffer from ruin. Also, when you hook someone, sometimes it could pause the whole game if people arent on comms or hooked doesnt have kindred, because everyone assumes what the other survivors are doing and you could have situations where everyone leaves their unfinished gen to go for an unhook only to see that the other 2 survivors also came. At the same time everyone could assume someone else is going for unhook and they all finish their gens at the cost of a second stage hook. At that point can you really blame the killer for tunneling the 2nd state hook because the rest of that persons team was greedy? (weird tangent)