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Nobody likes quitters, and definitely not griefers. Dead by Daylight is currently in a really bad state, with players going next, disconnecting repeatedly, and even being slugged for 4 minutes on end, just to bleed out at the very end.
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To the people who are dc'ing DON'T PLAY IF YOU ARE JUST NOT HAVING FUN.
slugging should not be nerfed you m0r_on. killers no longer have an incentive for hooking. all gen regression has been severely nerfed and bhvr has added tons of survivor hook perks. just recently they added the most broken perk ever, shoulder the burden. this perk is better and can change a game more than og dead hard.
I think a good addition to the bad sport queue would be to make it so when a survivor DCs, it doesn't replace them with a bot.
Incentivizing people not to leave and understand what it feels like to be left by a teammate.
great change suggestions, i hope they all get implemented !
As they should that shit needs to change for the sake of other survivors actually wanting to play the game
Software Engineer here:
Your creativity and effort is appreciated!
Here are some things to consider further:
There are an infinite number of smaller ways that a cry-baby survivor can give up. Running straight at the killer, or pulling out the internet cable. How might your solution affect adjacent problems like, trolling: a little intentional sandbag, barely afk or purposely missing a skillcheck on your gen. So how do you measure a bad sport? Managing player behaviour is what the "Report Player" feature is for (in post game lobby).
Make use of the report player button every time! Report the first person that DC's or gives up on first hook. Why will this help? BHVR will get an alert on their systems that there is an unusually high amount of reports and they will prioritise fixing this. Players can also ask for a solution to "go next" culture on DBD's support ticket website and on the "Anything else you want to say" question on the player satisfcation survey that is available right now to get them to prioritse this further.
BHVR will get the full picture from the player report data and figure it out from there along with ideas from the community.
Customer needs are their priority – there is a lot of customer needs and it takes time to make a good solution that works for a global audience.
Keep positive and be welcoming, tell frustrated players that it's okay to lose, it's just a game.
P.S. I don't work for BHVR.
P.S.S. Referring to the last sentence of the video, and I know there will be some in the comments too: The "devs don't care about us" mindset is toxic and useless. We are people too and we literally love what we work on
If im being chased for 3 minutes and not a single gen is done, im sorry but im killing myself on hook. Im not a helping a team that sucks win. Especially when the killer has no gen slow down perks. As much as i enjoy a good chase, i also enjoy winning. If my team is dropping like flies instantly, theres no chance of winning and it is a waste of time to keep going. But if you could pick the killer you prefer to go against, and have a higher chance of going against THAT killer, i think the game would be more fun for everyone. No one would quit because everyone in the lobby enjoys playing against that killer. Longer que times are fine as long as im consistently going against bubba. Killers like plague, houndmaster, legion etc its just not fun to loop. Its my personal opinion but the only time i give up on hook is if my team is horrible and nothing is getting done. If i feel like im wasting my time, im not going to play the game.
The only killer I ever go next against is Plague, and that's because I can not stand the sounds she and the survivors make while infected.
At least my Bot will be somewhat helpful, unlike IRL me who is struggling not to sympathy vomit with my survivor.
The last chance system on hook with the proposed way is basically Getting forced to wait 70 seconds to die against proxy camping killers against bumbling team mates who cant or wont go for the save with no hope in hell you can even try to get out out of that situation yourself. (And most decent killers who play know the distance to not built up anti-camp) Id have no reason to ever down the last survivor to ever give them a CHANCE to get themself off hook. I could just run them down til they hit stage 2. The only time the survivor would reasonably be able to pull off a chance to get off hook is if the stars aligned and they never got hooked and when most games would have ended anyways.
Kobes into flashlights would be nearly impossible, if even one survivor is up. Basement trapper wouldn't have to worry at all about someone getting off the hook. Deliverance and sables basement perk would would end up being a forced meta against any killer who knows how to guard.
I want a fix to people going next but having it so you only get a 1 in 10 chance you can get off if the game should be coming to an end is not it. And the only counters are two perks with specific requirements thats are super easy to get taken away. Found first with deli. Too bad. Someone unhooked someone before you could too bad, didnt get put in basement. Sorry buddy.
Thats not even getting into the worst possible outcome: getting forced to sit on hook for up to over 6 and a half minutes with a team of 3 survivors running shoulder the burden and reassurance actively keeping you on stage one hook any time you go down.
The crawling and the bad sports stuff seems pretty soild. Thought the bad sports lobbies have some questionable issues. Survivors going next are common. Killers not as much much. Does a random killer get given a bad sports lobby. Does one "bad sport" infect a whole team causing them to go into said lobbies? Couldn't you arguably force yourself into said bad sport lobbies to intentionally play against killers prone to leaving and raging?
Behavior adding bots to help survivors who dont give up was great and the issue of people using hooks to screw over the remaining team mates sucks. Leavers having a lesser penalty makes sense. More likely to leave and give a bot teammate. Ironically the way help people is to incentives people TO leave when they want to, but you should never "incentives" players to quit their team so its kinda a hard pill to push.
I'm a killer main but this whole quitter epidemic ruins my matches and is a big reason i don't play survivor because i don't have any friends to play with
The problem with all this is not the lack of a solution, but the lack of finding a solution. If they are not sure if these ideas are good and healthy for the game – let people try them for a few days, give an experimental queue like a separate game mode or just a 2 days in normal queue or as usually PTB to see where something needs to be improved, like they did with bloodlust.
hey! great video. I study game design for fun, and I noticed that your proposed self unhook change will create a lot of weird (and extremely unfun) scenarios.
Assuming self unhooks still get three attempts, the 10% chance turns into around 30% which means you really do not want to hook survivors that are still on first hook once everyone is on the ground. The likelihood of survivors Kobe'ing is way too high, so you might as well just leave them on the ground and let them bleed out so a comeback is impossible for the survivors. This leads to a situation where the optimal play is to bleed people out for 4 minutes. Even if it's only one self unhook attempt at 10%, it's still much less risky to simply bleed them out instead of potentially eating a DS or something (this is pretty much how things are in the live game, tbh, since 10% for one attempt vs a total of 11% across three attempts is not a big difference).
Not everyone will play like that since some people will make bad decisions on purpose if it means they get to avoid doing something boring, but most people don't mind being bored for a little bit to guarantee a victory. The self bleed out thing Scott suggested would help counteract this, but it still means that players would have to wait around to bleed out a bit more often than currently.
Another scenario would be where there is one or more hooked survivors on first stage, and the killer is chasing the last survivor standing that is not dead/dying/hooked. Once the killer downs the last survivor, the survivors on hook are now able to make self unhook attempts. This creates a situation where the optimal play for the killer is to NOT down the last survivor, and instead wait for the other survivors to hit second stage.
However, the last survivor standing will also know this and will be able to take advantage of the fact that the killer could potentially give the survivors a comeback if they go down. So what you would see is the killer staying close to the last survivor and not attacking them while they run up to their teammates and get ready for an unhook or pick up. This creates a stand-off scenario where if the killer doesn't want to down the last survivor and the last survivor doesn't want to make a move since their only moves are doing a gen while the killer stares at them or going for a one for one with a survivor on the ground or on the hook… making that survivor the new last survivor standing and putting them back into the same scenario where the killer doesn't want to down them since that would allow their teammate(s) to self unhook and last survivor's only move is to go for a one for one or sit on gen while the killer stares at them. Then the game becomes a very long and tedious series of one for ones where the killer is basically doing nothing and the survivors are basically doing nothing and it only ends once everyone is on second stage.
Not an ideal change, takes the already boring and tedious scenario of "the killer snowballed and now they have to go all over the map picking survivors up" and makes it take way more time than is necessary by adding in the whole "killer downing the last survivor is a bad move if another survivor is on first stage/slugged and not hooked, since it means the other survivor can now Kobe if they choose or if the killer decides to hook instead of bleed out."
Not trying to roast you, just that's the stuff designers have to think about when considering changes to base game mechanics. Thanks!
edit: I think that self unhooking needs to be reworked or removed, but this solution creates problems that are genuinely a lot more frustrating than a teammate providing you with the standard solo queue experience.
Yeah but also you cannot force survivors to stay in the game if the killers are being toxic to them. Nowadays the killers I've been facing are too much especially the Chucky ones since the nerf. So again you cannot blame the survivors for having enough of this bull.
3 minutes for a first-time disconnect is pretty harsh. Casual gamers will leave.
I love all these changes but constantly get disconnected because of a bad internet and would hate to be put in a bad sport queue because of it.
W silent hill music
We can't worsen DC penalties because as a console killer, I get DDOSed/gamebooted multiple times per week, and the game just registers it as a DC.
With this idea, I'd be stuck for 3mins, unable to play and then put into a "bad sport queue."
I am for making penalties greater, however until it becomes impossible for other players to get my IP from my gamertag, i would be against it.
as the killer, I will do whatever you want me to, except stand in the corner and do nothing if it does not interfere with my current challenge.
Great ideas, hope they get implemented. The constant quitters especially are a pain
ive been saying for a while when getting slugged we need a stand up mechanic, like the self unhook but it works when ur slugged. either get up or die faster
I had a legacy Claud do a Hawkins offering and give up on first hook. I don't get it
The simplest thing would be to remove the dc option from the menu.
even when i get a killer i hate playing against, i still try to play. giving up is just too boring and selfish
I would just remove unhooking yourself in general, only when you are camped then you can unhook yourself or if you use these 3 unhooking perks (slipery meat, deliverance, wicked), for sluging i would put that you can pick yourself up if killer slugs you for 30 seconds, give anti slug mechanic so if killer camps you when he sluggs you the anti slugging bar fills up and you get 10 seconds of endurance so he cant instantly down you when you pick yourself up, faster bleeding out is same problem as self unhooking people will just use it to go next, there should not be dc penalties at all just add killer bots, bots are pretty solid they just need to be fixed in end game that they dont leave no matter what untill they are the last survivors.
I like my idea! Instead of completely changing the game, how about put the power in the hands of the player. Have a report feature specifically for people who go next. If you go next too many time, you get perma banned! Then you go cry to your mummy while the people who actually want to play the game play you a lil song on the worlds smallest violin
I always say, don't be a bitch to your team and take the DC penalty. Might as well leave your team with a bot who might be even more useful than you… and no, just because there are cry babies who use the self-unhook mechanic as a "Next Game", I don't believe they shouldn't take away the ability to self-unhook with the 4% chance. I don't know about you, but those moments when you actually pull of a 4% self-unhook, while everyone is downed or you are about to get second stage, are the most exhilarating moments of DBD.
Otz's idea for the DC problem is aslo a pretty good additional fix.
If someone outside of your pre-made disconnects, everyone else can DC without a penalty and keep whatever point they've accumulated.
As both a killer and survivor player, DC's are by far the worst they've ever been currently and just ruin a big chunk of games daily.
Idk bro this game has the harshest DC penalties I’ve ever seen you can get a 30min ban really quick
dc penalties dont make sense. let them disconnect, and with dc add +100% to points for all other players, to keep others in game.
also players should also be able to join an existing game instead of a bot with +300% points, if they select that option (because not everyone will want to).
and problem is solved.
to minimize disconnects, players should have option to mark one killer they dont want to play with. because thats the main reason people dc.
i also kill myself on the hook. you cant take that away, because when one person is dead and there are still 5 generators left, game is over anyway.
Great that it's being brought up because it's really depressing speaking both from killer and soloq end, great solutions too. Personally I'd go a bit harder and just permaban IP's on repeating offenses but that's not gonna happen, and honestly I doubt this will happen either since BHVR doesn't really care about their game lmao, just take the cheater issue as an example, real shame :/
My teammates giving up on hook or DCing annoy me as much as anyone else but I feel like adding a bunch of penalties isn’t really a solution to the problem. Dbd has such a high rate of teammates giving up compared to any other online game I play and so I think there is probably some sort of foundational problem with the game itself that makes people just not want to play anymore the second they go down sometimes
Had a game i dcd in cause survivors didnt know how to body block legion power i swear the average iq for survivors is below room temp and thats the only reason killer mains havent all quit
Survivors are the worst part of playing Survivor. I don't know how the survivor community gaslit themselves into thinking ruining games for others is okay because they're slightly upset. I feel like DBD players need to spend more time playing PvP games.
Behaviour in a qna last year said they don't have any intentions at looking at self unhooking or dcs iirc. Could be misremembering but I recall being disappointed by their answer.
I think a bad sport queue could possibly also include people that are toxic in-game as well, maybe with a separate report option similar to unsportsmanlike. There should be a punishment for people who play nasty, since it ruins the fun for everyone. You shouldn’t be able to hump a downed survivor until they bleed out, intentionally t-bag a killer on every pallet, repeatedly slash on hook, or wait until the very last second of the endgame collapse to leave to waste the killer’s time. This game’s playerbase needs to get more civil in general. I think the worst aspects of it can come down to the playerbase wanting others to be miserable or not caring if other players are miserable.
See i personally think they should implement something like LoL where you cant even search for a new match/browse the store etc until the match you DC'd from is over and then get a DC penalty on top of that
Yah this is a big issue for DBD, i actually have been slugging people who attempt to kill themselves on first hook or run toward me “for a mercy kill” if they want to quit they can DC and let a bot take over.
Of course this could be seen as “toxic” but i’m also fed up with quitters even as a killer. I want to have fun matches regardless if i’m win or not. The biggest issue is when someone quits it causes a chain reaction on quitting, hell there been times i’ve played with four bots 😑.
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Other ideas
Survivors
If all survivors are in the dying state and after 5 secs from the last survivor being downed, the first survivor downed has the ability to pick himself up at the cost of 50% of the bleed out timer and are broken / exhausted / blinded for 3 secs. If within 1 sec that survivor doesn’t pick himself up, it transfers to the next downed survivor (this is to avoid killer from standing over the last). 5 secs becomes 20 secs for last 2 survivors and disabled at final.
Killer
If all survivors quit, the match ends. You’ll receive some blood points and won’t lose add-ons.
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Quitting added penalties (if you DC constantly only)
Reduce the amount of blood points / XP you’ll receive. This lasts the entire day
a big issue for me is being tunneled just because im playing and matching names with my long distance partner. its so cringe being tunneled and then humped and shit talked at end game all for just having someone who i love lmao. has happened more times than i can count
more games need to use the loser's queue.
I like the video, but I feel like the unhook rework could use some more time too cook, there is actual REASONS for people to want to die on hook (For example, when I am playing with a friend and me and them are the last 2 alive, I will usually just die to give them the hatch), there is probably more reasons but I am far too lazy rn to list them.
I'd love them to fix the poor lobby quality first. If I DC due to the lobby shutting down (or a hacker) I'd hate to be put into this almost timeout corner just for playing normally. Other then that, all those changes sound awesome, because Soloq is never a fun experience
i agree with the first two somewhat , and i agree with the last all the way . the first two has one issue it flat out hurts higher mmr or even high medium mrr killers and only really helps higher mmr survivors , does anyone really think the new survivor hud helped the ones it needed to help ? no . the new hud only helps swf and good survivors because no matter how much hand holding you give to a bad player in any game they will always be bad its up to them to "get gud" unfortunately