46 thoughts on “I Don't Like Behaviour's New Map Design Philosophy – Dead by Daylight”
Anything that is PvP based should equal being purely skillbased. Which means every single pallet should be equal ground so the overall better player or mindgamer will win. People dont get better at the game when you give them more crutches. Trash players will always find something to complain and strong players will always abuse what's best. You cant stop or deny either. Make literally everything even ground and people that seriously want to improve will improve. Solves also a lot of balancing issues regarding perks, addons and especially killer powers. Cause you build your house on even ground. It's that simple. Imagine how interesting and way more intense the game could be if every single upcoming loop is another skillbased interaction instead of yet another forced timewaste with barely any or factually no counterplay. I may only have 1500 hours but i play both sides a lot, got all achievements in the game and finished all tomes so i feel like my opinion is valid to be voiced.
Scott, your entire point is nullified due to how small the maps are know. It's not that most pallets are unsafe, they are all cramped together. Also, survivors get less distance on injury. So pallets must be somewhat closer than before but nowhere near as safe as before. I said multiple times in the past that making the maps smaller and smaller, will ruin the tiles in the game. That's basically what happened.
new map as a billy main is easily one of the worst in my opinion, because any time I rev the saw they just leave the loop and go to the next pallet and over and over again. the only time you can successfully get a down with the saw is when you activate overdrive. new map is is just forcing you to m1 only and it is boring.
Instead of adding more breakable walls like Saloon you just need a x3 pallet multiplier to create your own loops. The Minecraft philosophy of map making
I mostly like the new map design as long as its mostly balanced like in the unknowns map but i will definitely say that every new map shouldn't be like it because it would definitely be nice to have some diversity in map design but regardless of design they need to remain somewhat fair and playable to both sides and most playstyles
In 5 years you’ll load into a match and it will just be a coin toss when you get to a pallet. You bot get a prompt to chose heads or tails and If you lose you magically get injured and the loop disappears then you go to the next. Coin flip simulator basically.
I was afraid you were going to vouch for blackwater swamp or old mother's dwelling. I don't particularly disagree, but maybe a bit of innovation in the strong tiles (like Dwarka's weak loops) would be good
I don’t mind either, it really depends on the killer I’m playing honestly, both can be annoying in their own ways, I hate the rng that comes with the old maps, especially on that Macmillan map with the mine shaft, the middle part can have so many windows around each other it becomes unplayable as most killers, I think i’d prefer the old maps if they weren’t so rng based, but since there’s so much rng on the old maps I prefer a mix of old and new style maps
Not sure if this perspective matters but the unsafe pallets are just horrible for people who have high ping literally EMEA region suffers because there's no server for us. It doesn't matter if your reaction is god tier you will always lose the 50/50 at these pallets.
i just want variability. its boring on both extremes of pallet placements. When it's all short pallets I'm just bored because I don't have to think, I just run to the next avaialble one. When its all god pallets, same exact thing – but when i have the choice, I have the option to think about whether I need to use up a good resource or play an unsafe one to preserve it.
Nice video. You perfectly articulated why I hate the new map. I play against a lot of coordinated teams with players that have 5,000+ hours, and with the current Background Player shenanigans, every single down is easily contestable. It's a struggle enough as it is to get strong players down when they can loop, but when you can't even easily hook the survivor, the game is basically unwinnable. I heard OhTofu talking about the new map on a recent stream of his. He loves the design philosophy of having tons of pallets everywhere that are unsafe. He said that only bad killers struggle on the new map because they kick too many pallets. I think it's a lot more nuanced than that.
The other day I got hawkins as sakodo and I wanted to fucking DC so badly towards the middle of the match. I have survivors who knew how to chain the pallets and pre drop every single one they came too. It was so boring and tiring that I just didn't want to finish the game out. I use not mind hawkins that much but now I never want to play that fucking map XD
Another problem is the new map and maps like it don't have a lot of windows. Windows are a huge expression of survivor skill (and killer skill) along with a suite of perks that cannot be used much if there are few windows.
Yeah the new map sucks to play as a survivor… they can even remove bloodlust now if they want to push this kind of map designs…. a mix of of strong tiles with weaker ones is the best
I prefer more frequent unsafe pallet philosophy. Allows killers without anti-loop to have more skill expression. Sure you can chain them, but you can also chain unsafe pallet into safe pallet which is way worse.
As a Bubba main, thank you for mentioning Bubba. The map changes have increased pallet density and are making Bubba much less fun to play. Survivors are running from yellow to yellow and there is no space in between to catch them out.
Even as survivor I despise playing on these new maps. There's no significant skill input there, almost all the loops are a guaranteed hit if you actually try to loop them instead of chaining them (which often isn't an option, especially with my next point) and once your teammates have pre-dropped half of the pallets 15 seconds into the match, it just becomes a complete dead zone where your only options are brainlessly holding W or just standing still and accepting your fate.
Anything that is PvP based should equal being purely skillbased.
Which means every single pallet should be equal ground so the overall better player or mindgamer will win.
People dont get better at the game when you give them more crutches.
Trash players will always find something to complain and strong players will always abuse what's best.
You cant stop or deny either.
Make literally everything even ground and people that seriously want to improve will improve.
Solves also a lot of balancing issues regarding perks, addons and especially killer powers.
Cause you build your house on even ground.
It's that simple.
Imagine how interesting and way more intense the game could be if every single upcoming loop is another skillbased interaction instead of yet another forced timewaste with barely any or factually no counterplay.
I may only have 1500 hours but i play both sides a lot, got all achievements in the game and finished all tomes so i feel like my opinion is valid to be voiced.
Yea I'm not a fan of the new Map designs n prefer the macro side u were talking about
Scott, your entire point is nullified due to how small the maps are know. It's not that most pallets are unsafe, they are all cramped together. Also, survivors get less distance on injury. So pallets must be somewhat closer than before but nowhere near as safe as before. I said multiple times in the past that making the maps smaller and smaller, will ruin the tiles in the game. That's basically what happened.
It's been literal years, and Big Scott still doesn't let Little Scott talk. Look at that lil fella! Let him speak!
new map as a billy main is easily one of the worst in my opinion, because any time I rev the saw they just leave the loop and go to the next pallet and over and over again. the only time you can successfully get a down with the saw is when you activate overdrive. new map is is just forcing you to m1 only and it is boring.
As a killer main, they should remove all pallets.
For me it’s just the number of pallets in general. Just cut them all by 10%
"This can be a jungle gym" fuckin giggled
Instead of adding more breakable walls like Saloon you just need a x3 pallet multiplier to create your own loops. The Minecraft philosophy of map making
The new loops are like playing old Spirit plus Alien can hit you over all of them.
Who doesn't like playing Pallet Break Simulator
DbD is such a unique game. Almost a decade in and we are still arguing about what the core gameplay is supposed to look like.
I mostly like the new map design as long as its mostly balanced like in the unknowns map but i will definitely say that every new map shouldn't be like it because it would definitely be nice to have some diversity in map design but regardless of design they need to remain somewhat fair and playable to both sides and most playstyles
unsafe pallet
I agree with you Scott, I like being able to manage resources in this game. I feel like a better player when I’m not just pre dropping pallets.
In 5 years you’ll load into a match and it will just be a coin toss when you get to a pallet. You bot get a prompt to chose heads or tails and If you lose you magically get injured and the loop disappears then you go to the next.
Coin flip simulator basically.
I was afraid you were going to vouch for blackwater swamp or old mother's dwelling. I don't particularly disagree, but maybe a bit of innovation in the strong tiles (like Dwarka's weak loops) would be good
scott are you telling me you DONT enjoy getting bloodlusted by a ghostface for 8 minutes!?!?!?!?!?!
I don’t mind either, it really depends on the killer I’m playing honestly, both can be annoying in their own ways, I hate the rng that comes with the old maps, especially on that Macmillan map with the mine shaft, the middle part can have so many windows around each other it becomes unplayable as most killers, I think i’d prefer the old maps if they weren’t so rng based, but since there’s so much rng on the old maps I prefer a mix of old and new style maps
A good loop money system consists of not just many $1 bills but of a variety of high and low values.
8yrs in and BHVR still cannot make a genuinely good map.
Not sure if this perspective matters but the unsafe pallets are just horrible for people who have high ping literally EMEA region suffers because there's no server for us. It doesn't matter if your reaction is god tier you will always lose the 50/50 at these pallets.
Take a shot every time scott says "pallet" 😂
i just want variability. its boring on both extremes of pallet placements. When it's all short pallets I'm just bored because I don't have to think, I just run to the next avaialble one. When its all god pallets, same exact thing – but when i have the choice, I have the option to think about whether I need to use up a good resource or play an unsafe one to preserve it.
It's stupid how they have this specific design philosophy in mind, but half of the killers ignore these rules.
Why even care about balance at this point when they turn clown into sonic the hedgehog and a chunk of killers just ignore pallets altogether.
Maybe the new map design is just a stealth buff to Pallet Freddy
I feel like its not a New Map Design Philosophy its just only this particular map cause every other new map was insanely survivor sided
Nice video. You perfectly articulated why I hate the new map. I play against a lot of coordinated teams with players that have 5,000+ hours, and with the current Background Player shenanigans, every single down is easily contestable. It's a struggle enough as it is to get strong players down when they can loop, but when you can't even easily hook the survivor, the game is basically unwinnable. I heard OhTofu talking about the new map on a recent stream of his. He loves the design philosophy of having tons of pallets everywhere that are unsafe. He said that only bad killers struggle on the new map because they kick too many pallets. I think it's a lot more nuanced than that.
Thank god I'm not the only one who noticed this.
The other day I got hawkins as sakodo and I wanted to fucking DC so badly towards the middle of the match. I have survivors who knew how to chain the pallets and pre drop every single one they came too. It was so boring and tiring that I just didn't want to finish the game out. I use not mind hawkins that much but now I never want to play that fucking map XD
There’s a reason why people want Macmillan autohaven coldwind
I'm so tired of kicking palettes, man.
Also having next to no safe pallets means some killers will just wait for bloodlust and since all the tiles are unsafe you can’t force a pallet break
i agree
BHVR’s map design philosophy has always been “What would hurt Trapper the most?”
Scott yet again having a good take.
Another problem is the new map and maps like it don't have a lot of windows. Windows are a huge expression of survivor skill (and killer skill) along with a suite of perks that cannot be used much if there are few windows.
Yeah the new map sucks to play as a survivor… they can even remove bloodlust now if they want to push this kind of map designs…. a mix of of strong tiles with weaker ones is the best
I prefer more frequent unsafe pallet philosophy. Allows killers without anti-loop to have more skill expression. Sure you can chain them, but you can also chain unsafe pallet into safe pallet which is way worse.
Why is Scott calling Hawkins "a new map"? I thought it didn't changed much, if at all, from its original release.
So run EnFury, heard you loud and clear
My only issue is that I feel like maps should be bigger. To make 3 gening harder, they should make the maps bigger.
I think a new design is needed for variety, so it's okay.
As a Bubba main, thank you for mentioning Bubba. The map changes have increased pallet density and are making Bubba much less fun to play. Survivors are running from yellow to yellow and there is no space in between to catch them out.
Even as survivor I despise playing on these new maps.
There's no significant skill input there, almost all the loops are a guaranteed hit if you actually try to loop them instead of chaining them (which often isn't an option, especially with my next point) and once your teammates have pre-dropped half of the pallets 15 seconds into the match, it just becomes a complete dead zone where your only options are brainlessly holding W or just standing still and accepting your fate.
I hate it.
scott i think you're a great political speaker