Read more Dead by Daylight ➜ https://deadbydaylight.mgn.tv
http://www.twitch.tv/ScottJund
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Read more Dead by Daylight ➜ https://deadbydaylight.mgn.tv
http://www.twitch.tv/ScottJund
https://discord.gg/TheBreaderhood
source
They will never tell us the variables bc if we know we will try and circumvent it. If its that easy to manipulate its a bad system in the first place. BHVR won't weight for individual Killers or how bad some of the maps are. They think pig is viable bc he has a high kill% at low ranks. They also said they don't consider individual killer when making a map(shocking). They might weight for killer perks like pop/ruin/undying/BBQ, win %, average kills per game, and MAYBE playtime up to a certain point.
What you described is what tofu made a video about. OW/league/CSGO all have essentially divisions with multiple ranks inside each division. DBD takes what is the top 4-6 divisions in other games and crams them together. They won't do that though unless that same update comes with a huge spirit/nurse nerf.
Guess is time to knuckle down and learn to play nothing but Nurse and Spirit. Could only play a few games during the MMR test and it wasn't consistent. mean while regular DBD has been hella fucking sweaty for me lately.
I agree that they need to be more transparent with mmr. I play in a good 4 man when I play survivor and for the recent test we changed from meme builds to playing like a death squad. The killers we got put against got worse probably due to the fact that each of us was getting one long chase every 4 games due to the fact that we got gens done in 5 minutes and used meta perks to save the person who was getting camped and tunnelled. We even stopped using perks but this didn’t change anything except having to abandon the person on hook who was getting face camped at the end.
After seeing that it’s obvious that playing optimally doesn’t increase the mmr, from my experience.
I don't think having Sbmm will be good for this game. Besides the balance game, just casual players in general. Maybe a survivor plays with a friend that's try hard and stuff, they play for about an hour, and the try hard helps the less "skilled" player escape most of the time. That less skilled player will start getting lobbies with killer mains that only play killer, breathe killer. It'll be very unmotivating to keep playing.
I have sub 250 hours in the game and I made it to red ranks playing pretty casually. As soon as I hit green ranks I started getting sweat squads who literally run circles around me. At red ranks, I literally cannot play a match without at least one survivor with 2k+ hours in the game (checking their steam profile), so I don't really understand the arguments of "you're not going to get tournament level players in every match." Because I don't think that applies to all players. It's rare for me to go up against a team that isn't running all meta perks and clearly know exactly how to loop effectively. I see the survivors my friend goes up against, he's a higher rank than I am and he goes up against complete jokes by comparison. I would have hoped that mmr would allow us to get a grasp on new killers without going up against constant sweat drinkers, but however bhvr set it up seems to be a pretty poor metric. At this point, I think I would just prefer a casual and ranked mode for the game, and reward ranked players with cosmetics and/or bloodpoints based on the rank they reached before the end of rank reset. That way the sweaty 4man swfs can stay away from people who are trying to play the game because they enjoy it.
I did not get a good first impression of MMR. Three red rank teammates with self-care vs a sloppy butcher spirit.
knowing bhvr, think of the laziest way mmr could work and that's probaly how it actually works. so it's completly based on the pip system.
They should do exclusive season skins per character if you are in top percent. Maybe 30%. Would have to win like 20 matches on that survivor to get it in the top 30%.
i didn’t play much killer during the test but having solo queue teammates that can at least touch a gen was amazing
Tru3ta1ent
The best demogorgon in the world just get's a top hat and nothing else.
I think they should consider making 2 separate values for killers, first for specific killer skill and second for the killer role in general. I think it would be better as for example: You are a Wraith main and never played Billy, when MMR is on then you will get strong survivors when you play Wraith and total potatoes when you would play as Billy.
The thing is, while you play as Wraith you get a general knowledge about the killer role like playing pallets, when to kick gens or not, etc. Now the system only tracks your experience for each killer individually and treat your new killers or the ones you haven't played in a long time as if you were completely new to the game. With two separate statistics, one global and one for the specific killer, it would make it fairer for both roles as new survivors won't get matched with experienced killers that took a long break from specific character and killers as they could learn their new, freshly bought characters with survivors that know what is going on instead of genphobic, hiding in a map corner survivors.
my very 1st killer match under the MMR test I used the Wraith and got four rank 1s on Cowshed…. I got two hooks. Played about 5 more matches with Wraith after that and was the same…. I think I got 4 kills in 6 matches. I don't think I've ever had to sweat that much for that many consecutive games in the 3+ years I've been playing. Wraith is one of those killers for me that I'm usually very good with. I may not "win" every match, but I usually put up a good fight and have fun doing it. Whether I win or lose, i really don't care…. I just want the match to be fun and feel like both sides had a shot. Those matches weren't fun. I played about 6 matches earlier today with match making back to normal… and all the matches I had were fun and competitive. To be honest… if we do get this MMR system and it continues to play out the way it did during the test…. I probably won't play killer much. There's other things I can do if I want to be stressed out that much. When I played survivor during the test… I got baby killers every match. I'll stick to that… it may not have been challenging, but at least I didn't have to sweat my ass off while trying to have fun. Yeah, I de-pipped almost every match because the killer couldn't catch anyone… but if I'm gonna de-pip… I might as well have fun doing it, right?
Hey Scott would you say your a better killer than Tru3 Talent, just speaking on the game and nothing else. He said in general Eu has much more competition than Na, killer and survivor wise.
If MMR is fully implemented into the game permanently, content creators and all those trying to just have fun with say, a meme build will no doubt have to reevaluate their perspective on winning. Because if you go against a good team with a meme build you most likely have no chance of winning. That is the fact of the matter. At this point I believe the only logical step is to abandon the long withstanding opinion that a 4k is a win. DBD will then become more of a, "That's a clip!" Type of game. Where your build working once is the victory, not the 4k
My queue times are so fucking long now my god
I'd be completely ok with MMR if the game was more balanced, but it's still horrendously unbalanced. Such as the nature of asymmetrical games. You'll be ok if you main nurse, spirit, maybe Hag, or maybe Blight. But that's only 4 out of 24 killers in the game. If you've mained any other killer for a long time you get totally punished with this system. I think we can all agree that this is stupid right? They need to buff a lot of the other killers before we can have an MMR system. And I'm not a fan of the whole "gEt GoOd" argument. This game is not competitive and as far as I know, it's not really meant to be. If it was meant to be competitive, they're doing a terrible job.
So your vid made me think of a single question:
These survivors that make you play sweaty for a win when you don't want to. They're still playing when MMR isn't active. Are you saying they need to be paired with worse killers? Like are you saying the less skilled should deal with horrible bully matches so that you don't have to consistently compete at your own level?
This isn't a dig or an attack just a genuine question, is that how you want the distribution of sweaty games to be? Shared evenly amongst the skilled and unskilled alike?
I feel like they should have a separate system for each. Sure the queue times would go down but if theres a ranked queue where mmr is utilised and a casual where mmr is not then it fits the sweaty players who want to really challenge themselves to become the best and it fits the people who don't care about who they play against and just want to mess around and have fun (like Scott). It doesn't have to become a competitive esport like league or anything but if it gives people an opportunity to use mmr to their advantage then why can't we just keep both parties satisfied instead of ruining one sides fun in favour of the other, so many other games have a similar system and it works: the people who play normal games in league tend to play casually and for fun, people who play ranked matches tend to try harder and use the meta to try and climb to get as high as they can.
At the end of the day would people rather sacrifice queue times for higher quality games? It's a personal decision I suppose, it's hard to say if it would be worth it and I can't come up with a real answer but I think killer mains would say yes it's worth it and survivor mains would say no because the queue times are already a problem and they already have the long end of the stick in that they aren't handicapped by the games naturally not great balance at the higher level of play: a killer main at high level would probably rather have a longer queue time than be thrown against 4 man rank 1 SWF bully squads every single game unless they play nurse of spirit I hypothesise, and a survivor in SoloQ would not rather have the longer queue time because if they end up getting tunneled out of the game or forced into a bad team they don't want to have to queue up again and wait half an hour for the same thing to happen. SWF will probably not care about longer queue times since they don't have to get other survivors, but they will care about their 90% win rate forcing them to play against nurse and spirit every game so I think SWF players would probably be against MMR because there is 0 benefit: it just makes them more likely to be into sweaty 0 fun killers.
I'm a global elite demogorgon
That's so funny
To me:
0 Kills is an obvious loss
1 Kill is a loss
2 Kills is a Tie
3 Kills is a win
4 Kills is a big win.
I think its around 1:55, but hearing you talk about the intricacies of just the VOLUME of things that can affect skilled play in dbd really goes to show that you are fuckin' insanely knowledgeable about this game, I appreciate the talking points in your videos and I hope you dont stop doing them
Any sort of mmr/sbmm system is such a pain to implement well unfortunately, that's why I tend to oppose it in most games, especially those that don't have a separate ranked mode. MMR creates a clear divide between the casual and competitive playerbase, and the fact is that for any pvp game, the top 5% of players usually have very different playstyles, strategies, and of course skill, compared to the majority of the game's players, and having to balance around both is never easy. MMR systems tend to either worsen the casual experience, or worsen the competitive experience, it's nearly impossible to balance both in a way that keeps both playerbases happy.
One of my biggest worries is that this is going to further the divide in skill between survivors playing as a swf, and survivors playing solo. If killers are going to be forced to play against more skilled players, they'll play more efficiently, which is going to hurt the solo survivors that lack any sort of meaningful communication between their teammates, but barely affect the swfs that already have access to voice chat and can make easy callouts on what the killer is doing.
"Sprinkle my balls with something" ~ Scott Jund 2021
If you could just learn to be happy with a 2k you'd never need to sweat
To me a win is if you get 3 kills or 4 and for survivor it’s a 3 man escape or 4. A tie would just be 2 kills or 2 escapes
You can't say you play "as nice as possible" when you run ruin undying or ruin pop pretty much every single game. That is not very nice.
I played Billy for the first
Time yesterday after playing my main hag the players I was still going against the same players
i feel like the ranks need a bigger span. Like im talking ranks 1 to 50.
If they would just balance the fucking game it wouldn't be such an issue but they just don't care to for whatever reason which would be fine if they weren't trying to actually make a skill based game where you play with equal level players every game, but they're making this MMR system…so which is it BHVR?
For the reward it your like a top player or if you get a lot of wins, you could get a lot of shards and Bloodpoints. Something to make players want to go against really good players.
Honestly i like the idea of mmr but i feel like maybe they should allow you to switch it on or off like cross play possibly or like a new game mode or something like that because honestly unless they implement a decay on killers you will eventually get to a point where you cant play chill and you have to play sweaty all the time and like scott said that isnt always going to be fun along with the fact there is legit no rewards for it either at the moment
i 4k at red rank with pig i went from rank 20 to rank 1 with legit only pig. No bbq or pop(i hate bloodwebs) only save the best for last, surveillance, ruin, and corrupt
Almost every streamer I've seen complains when they play killer and go against a good team of survivors. Their attitude totally changes when they have to try at the game. Same with survivors; they are all fine with getting gens and easy chases but complain when they get hooked a lot.
I’m 100% sure it goes by pips because I had an AFK killer where I double pipped and then after that I never played ANY killer except sweaty nurses. And I’m solo Q it’s impossible to win.
So yea I won 1 game in MMR
All im hoping for is that if the do put in a new mmr system that doesnt take away from casual game play. I like playing with friends but i hate competitive games and was glad that dbd was not designed to be that way and i hope it never will be. I dont want to be challenged to the extreme after working 8hrs everyday, i want to have fun and laugh but also have it to be exhilarating as well.
But if the matchmaking is decent, you shouldn't have to play nurse or spirit to 4k. If you can play the game while looking at chat, then that is your skill level that the game should be balancing around. Your MMR will adjust to how you play. Full attention going sweaty? your MMR will go up and put you with top survivors. Playing casually, looking at chat, running more fun perks? Your MMR will drop and put you against easier opponents.
I was a rank 12 survivor first game of the mmr system I went against a ranked 4 demogorgon and my teammates were gray ranks the only reason I escaped was I was running plunder got a key and open hatch after he shut it
also my mmr experience sucked.
As survivor my teammates were rank 20’s when im rank 1 and my killers were all rank 15-20 wraiths, huntresses, and clowns and were literal babies.
As killer im also rank one and i got a team of one red rank and the other 3 were literally brand new
Everyone by now knows why a MMR based Matchmaking will break the game for high level players, so I will come straight to the point: I just don't want MMR to be implemented with this "balance" of a game. Dbd is a casual party game and should always remain one. If anythings, please devs, give us at least the option to choose between MMR on and off. As the playerbase is getting bigger and bigger, queue time shouldn't be problematic.
Almost every high level player (survivor and killer mains) would strongly dislike a forced MMR system. So please devs, listen to us!
The point of match balancing isn't supposed to be rewarding people who are good, it's to make sure people who spend their life on the game don't get to play against people that are new or just playing on their break.
You shouldn't get rewarded for just being a better player needing to play against also good players, it isn't a punishment to not bully people just trying to chill with a couple dozen hours. You 100% should have harder matches if you have thousands of hours, that's all you should be getting.
A win is when you have a great time without having to be cheesy.