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Dead by Daylight Should be about hooks not kills.
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Your ideas has no substances. Please tell me how you incentivize killers not to tunnel / camp for kills?
Players do what’s effective. Tunneling someone out at 5 gens is effective. Using bnp and map offerings is effective for survivors. There is no way around this.
You keep throwing these ideas out without thinking them through thoroughly.
Your proposed idea is to debuff the survivor each time they’re hooked. There is a perk that’s already in the game for this – dying light. Stacking multiple debuffs onto debuff after debuff isn’t the solution. If a killer can get a survivor out of the game @ 5 gens, why wouldn’t they ?
It’s evidence players do what’s effective. People abuse perks, items, and Addons just to win. The only way to force hooks > kills is to literally stop killer’s ability to tunnel and camp.
Crazy enough, the devs are trying. Borrowed time is basekit. Borrowed time + a haste buff was added baseline to make tunneling less effective, yet people still do it. Off the record and reassurance were added to combat this, yet people still tunnel. Killers can’t see how many times a particular survivor has been hooked because the devs feels like this would incentive more camping and tunneling. It’s the only logical reason to NOT show how many times a survivor has been hooked for killer.
Would love to see a detailed proposal of how to make people go for hooking a different survivors instead of going after the same survivor who was just unhooked. Without major impacting the other side.
thumps up for title alone
I’ll never forget the first game I played as wraith.
So basically I used strategy after I caught a survivor I would hook them wait for the rescuer then go for the rescuer when they showed up.
I didn’t stay at the hook though I committed to the chase but they didn’t last very long.
We were on mothers dwelling too long before the rework.
I wasn’t aware back then camping and tunneling were taboo I was literally just playing the game and omg the salt in the endgame chat.
Calling me a noob trash camper losing to me a wraith with 1 perk.
I wasn’t even aware what I did wrong and they were just mad about me hook camping and I’m like “why does it matter it worked” their arguments didn’t go beyond insults and saying “just don’t camp”.
They literally could not justify their anger or answer legitimate questions I was asking like “isn’t this literally the game”
Had two games one as twins one as wesker. For twins I didn't get my first hook till two gens left. So I tunneled first hooked person out. As a result I was able to make a comeback. Then I had a game as wesker, this time I brought gen regression perks, map was rpd and I didn't get a single hook until 1 gen left. In both games I got a 4 k thanks to tunneling one survivor or proxy camping. Yet in both games I was told by the survivors I was a shit killer and bad at the game and tunneled and camped lol. It's ridiculous how I'm forced into positions where I need to do something to have a chance at winning, however the ones who force you into that position get upset despite themselves being efficient.
Yeah the devs kinda screwed up their own game
I mean yeah but if it was balanced around hooks then the game becomes unbalanced in the killers favour if they go for kills so:
gen rush = hook rush
Gen rush < kill rush
My suggestion is making a dbd 2, where they start from the beginning, they make roots to build on, add replays, start adding killers gradually where they are all the same level, add perks which all have the same effectiveness, add maps in which they are balanced for both sides, make a NEW gameplay instead of having people have boring gameplay of sitting on gens, make more balanced tiles
Just make a new start, look at how overwatch have so many heros and they almost all have the same effectivness regardless of the different styles and roles and gameplays of each hero
u know even tho i disagree with some things that u say, i honestly agree with DBD Hook System that u normally talk about, DBD should be on hooks and not kills, since its much more rewarding and fun, skilled people in this game can win and also lose to even less skillful players, there is no such a thing comp game full of bugs and RNG< this isnt poker, this is a pvp game that was built for fun, they push the narrative of dbd for comp for marketing and to force people to buy perks to win games, its absurd.
As a killer you literally are the play mate and must ensure that the survivors have fun by playing according to their rules.
Whether you died or escaped as a survivor. It does not matter. You still end up at the camp fire waiting for the next trial.
idk theres a million ways to win as kill but only one win condition for survivor. if u take away the hatch then the only way a survivor can win is if his team isn't bad . as a killer u can still win even if u dont get 4k but without hatch now killer the kill is likely to to meet all win conditions . the hatch is to stop the killer from meeting them all so easy. if theres a bad team then thats a horrible snow ball without any chance to atleast rob the killer of some chase or 4k or hocks
Thank you Tru3 for being the voice always
This is just me spitballin' but what if killers had a 5th perk they could bring to the trial but it only activates if you hook all survivors at least once? Could be a kind of a "super perk", something that makes it worth your time. Combining this with the hooks over kills for killers might help change things around a bit.
not just threats, but ddos attacks too.
Death threats over a video-game. Nah, I'm toxic, but not that toxic…tunneler
This is exactly what I've been saying. I just had this same conversation on my stream.
don't blame the player blame the game never been more true for dbd in it current state
Yup, agreed with you years back when you had the discussion with Otz and agree with you today. Hooks were at one point a priority amd the game was healthier to play. Toxicity was still there, but quite tame and would only arise from one or two players every few games. Shoot, back then the streamers were kind and taught their viewers how to play a certain killer really well. Now a lot of streamers spread the toxicity with entitlement and narcissistic behavior, and often when you play Killer you find yourself punished if you don't tunnel someone out of the game as fast as you can before they finish the five generators.
Genuinely, I preached this game to my friends a few years ago because of how genius the pip system actually was. You could realistically have all 5 of the players of the game "winning." The survivors could have had good chases, healed each other, and did time on gens and gained a pip even if they died, while the killer could have gotten a bunch of hooks, had fast chases, and applied a lot of pressure to gens/healing and still gained a pip even if all 4 escaped. It created a system where it felt like the game was trying to reward you for playing well, and killing survivors/dying was a secondary effect that would happen if the game went a certain way.
It is SUCH a shame that this system was for all intents and purposes discarded when you think about it, because with just a little of TLC the pip system could easily have prevented this tunneling/kill rushing issue AND the gen rushing issue because escaping while doing nothing but gens wouldn't give you a pip or getting a 4k without getting a lot of hooks or doing a lot of chases wouldn't give you a pip either.
Boiling this game down to "did you escape" makes actually ZERO sense when you think about it, because escaping does not even come close to telling the story of how well you played, or how good you are at the game overall. A garbage self-care urban evasion player can hide 100% of the game, do nothing, and escape because their team plays well and with the MMR system "win" just as much as the player who actually did the gens, went for saves, and looped the killer. How does that make sense? The reverse is also true for killer, facecamping basement with insidious Bubba and getting a 4k gives the exact same amount of MMR as actually looping, pressuring gens, and going for hooks and winning with a 4k that way. No one can possibly argue the skill that the second situation actually takes in comparison, and yet there is no difference in the actual game.
Actually such a crime that a game as good as this one has devs as blind to solvable issues as these. They actively seek to make their game less fun.
an improved pip system will make me have fun again, that and gen speed balance
Kills always have been the win condition!
The game ends, when every survivor either is dead or has escaped. Whoever has more kills/escapes win.
The pip system is just some historical relic without a real meaning.
If the old pip system would determine the win, it wouldn't be possible for both sides to get pips and therefore be the winner. That's contradicting the basic principle of win-lose.
When you are pushing the "hook over kills" perspective, why aren't you making any thoughtful suggestions on how to change the game?
Balancing perks and gens differently won't help, because killers would just take their kills more easily instead of prioritizing hooks. At least as long as their perspective on the win condition remains the same.
One "outside the box" approach would be to rework the entire hook counter mechanic. For example you could just implement one counter combining all hook states of all survivors. And then the 6th hook causes the survivor to die, no matter who it hits. And after that the 8th hook and so on.
Don't pretend like you convinced Otz from your perspective.
He didn't really change that due to your discussion. He stopped the streak series mostly because he almost wen through all killers and because he gets bothered by MMR, stream sniping.
On the other hand YOU are the one doing some streaks nowadays. Although that was the major topic of your discussion and you being heavily against that type of streaming content.
So you are always able to tell beforehand, how certain changes (like base-kit BT, Unbreakable or Dead Hard rework) are gonna come out in the game?
Why don't we talk about power struggle. I do remember how you were insisting on the fact, that it's gonna be the new meta and super op for swf (if it allows multiple uses). And where are we now? It's just a meme build, because it's bad.
Honestly you're just as good/bad at predicting such things as the regular streamer (/player with 2000 hours) is, maybe you should realize that at some point and stop being so arrogant
Tru3 i know you read comments you are a voice of reason for many of us thank you
Sadly Tru3 the devs have pushed the game even more towards kills with the recent update of ruthless killer only showing up at a 4k.
Awesome shirt Tru3!
Imagine if instead of 3 hooks then death, the killer actually had a terror meter or smth similar. You would then have the terror meter fill with unique hooks and hooking someone other than the last person. You could also make the terror meter fill quicker or slower based on how fast you down in a chase to add some intensity, rewarding survivors for longer chases, and incentivizing the killer to chase more for quick downs, etc… The game could be more fun this way, encouraging less camping and tunneling, but instead… nah kills have to be the only thing sadge
Agree im sick of tunnel and camping if the game was about hooks you could go for different survivors!
the NEW HUD is freaking stupid! and 100% not fair killers have to try vs bullysqads even more! like wtf i came to play a game not a stressful game to much free info survivors is just dumb. survivors know when your chasing someone now stealth and big terror radius goes out the window alot of times. it should of only been a survivor thing no killer information given to them!, like they should only see what survivors are working on!, sick and fucking tired of the free bees and this game not being scary anymore.