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Intro: 0:00
What is MMR/SBMM?: 0:37
My Experience with MMR in DBD: 2:31
First Misconception About Disliking MMR: 3:59
Second Misconception About Disliking MMR: 6:05
Key Point Behind it’s Dislike: 7:18
Experience with the original SBMM/MMR in Halo: 7:34
The Founding Father of SBMM doesn’t like Modern Matchmaking: 7:52
Where’s The Variability?: 8:38
What’s the Solution?: 9:43
Conclusion: 11:53
Outro: 14:03
Dead by Daylight
source
Behavior's MMR system has almost nothing to do with skill at all. Their "skill based matchmaking" is actually a "player retention system". Its whole purpose is to keep you playing. You have a rough day and acquire a lot of losses? Your next day will be against the easiest players ever, to re pull you back in. This is their system. If you keep playing, you keep paying for their services.
There is indeed an MMR system that tracks your "rank" but that isn't the point of their system. Because if it was, my SWF team would only ever see higher end killers. But what happens? Nope we get put against new players and average players that we stomp game after game after game, with the rare p100 blight that puts up a chance. So we win 100+ games in a row. You'd think my MMR would be high and I'd be playing with other highly skilled players, right? That would make sense, right? Nope. I play solo and I'm put with 3 other new players that barely know what they're doing that is a total shit show and a guaranteed loss.
Their system barely has anything to do with skill and decent matches and only exists to keep people playing by either giving you a win, or giving an easy win to the killer. There is no middle grounds. There is no "close games". Its either you being stomped because you won too many matches. Or you getting an easy game because you've been stomped.
The sad part (and some of the newer players aren't aware of this) the old Rank system was actually the best MMR system. Playing as killer or survivor, I was always playing with average to advanced players. It was waaaaay more accurate in terms of balance. And then this bullshit new system came along and its the most batshit random gaming experiences. I guess it shouldn't be surprising but they replaced a decent system with a broken system and actually took a step backwards. But like I said, this new system is about player retention and nothing to do with balanced matches.
I just want to know that people in my solo que matches tried. Losing isn't the problem. Knowing that I never stood a chance because my teammates are new players going against a decent killer, that provide no resistance or don't know how to work on gens, isn't fun. Which is what I liked about the old rank system. I knew that teammates would ATLEAST be average skill and it will be a decent game.
Farmer I get your points but unranked wouldn't be good either for newbies and they'd think ranked is for the big dogs and avoid it until they're ready. It would also divid the community more and I hate seasons in video games personally. There'd also be the problem of new survivors getting experienced killers or the other way around and that wouldn't be fun for anyone there, but I do agree the DC plenty needs to gtfo.
I cant express how much I am for that ranked and casual mode. Burntout feels awful because I genuinely love Dead By Daylight and I dont want that fun feeling to fade away. However its tiring going through the same formula over and over again
Respect for letting those new players have a good time, it was hilarious when you straight up stared into that flashbang 😂
as long as i can get bloodpoints from casual, im more than fine with having a ranked/unranked mode
remember old rank system? it was pretty much the most awful mm system ever
at red ranks/rank 1 you saw the same builds everygame ds/dh/ub/iw so even before mmr there was no variety.
and at the 13th of every month your rank gets pushed back and then you encountered both the people who also got pushed back and the babies that were climbing their way up
it was a mess it was unfun.
mmr was honethsly bhvr's best option and it mostly did a good job of sperating babies from more experienced people and matching you with players almost at the same level.
it was way too strict at first and bhvr understandably loosened it.
now with the meta shifts they have done there's more variety in builds than there has ever been (more when mft gets nerfed) but people still understandably want to win and i don't think creating a ranked vs casual mode is gonna solve the problem.
i think mmr (in dbd) is fine they just need to tweak it a bit more.
i agree with you but i'm almost certain that dbd will never add any new fucking modes no matter how much we ask for them or even if the mobile version gets them so whatever. i guess we can rot
Mmr is the main reason I stopped playing killer before mmr it was actually fun now it's just sweatfest
This video doesn’t really make much sense to me🤔. If you want games to have more variety, making MMR less strict doesn’t seem like the solution. If you want the game to have more variety, the solution should be to buff weaker killers and perks, and nerf stronger killers and perks. That way the meta is wider with more killer and perk options, making the game have more variety. Making MMR stricter seems like a net positive for the game🤷♂️.
I think sbmm needs to get removed from most games including DbD. BHVR should add more tutorials and force new players to play at least 3 bot matches of increasing difficulty so they get a decent idea of what to do and expect.
Also I completely agree with what you said about the dc penalty. It needs to go asap.
this should be sent directly to bhvr…..you are absolutely correct. ive played since the start and ive had to take long breaks just due to it not being fun or the same thing over and over. i do play casually and dont care too much on winning IF other aspects were more fun…like interactions with memes or good chases etc. i also do agree that not getting a kill over an over or not escaping too many times in a row, does affect stress and fun in the game. i dont sweat my ass off but it does feel good to "win" now and then. they need rid of it fully or more like what you said with the two modes. they need something to break the cycle of it being the same all the time. i do end up wanting to exit the match asap when i see killer going way too hard and sweaty and other survs not doing shit. im not going to sit here and suffer for another whole match if its just going to be another boring do nothing game. ive even tried to stay and end up with the 3 gen or other game stand off games to the point it closes after an hour.
I really dislike the "You just want to stomp baby killers/survivors" argument. No, I don't want to sweat all the time. I don't want to feel compelled (like I have been) for two years now to run a conventionally powerful exhaustion perk with an anti-tunnel perk and some info/chase perks every single game. Sometimes I want to run some terrible Autodidact and Solidarity BS because it's fun to experiment once you have all these perks available to you.
Also, I hard agree on the DC penalty take.
See, I just wish it would tell you what type of match you are getting. I can’t really tell from prestige levels and cosmetics these days and I’m constantly shocked on who is giving up and who is trying super hard.
I love going against super hard survivors. I just wanna be aware at the start.
it took them long enough to make the change but im glad they did. the game was getting unironically stale
Hi I'm glad to know I'm not the only one burnt out since the change.
I went from get home and play dbd until I get tired to playing dbd for an hour or 2 at most because of how much worse my matches had become on both sides
Legit it's not fun at all rn idek man
i hope something gets changed it's really making me burn out and it sucks because I was so into dbd recently
The variety in MMR is the only thing that keeps me playing. Back when Iri rank actually meant something, I never, NEVER, made it there. Once you got past a certain point, it was nothing but sweats every match, and I would end up taking breaks from the game for months at a time due to frustration.
Now, I was a newb back than, so it might not actually have been as bad as I felt it was, but currently in game if I get a match where I get absolutely outplayed and outperformed, no kills, barely any hooks, then I'm not going to get a lower MMR, I'm not going to make it to 'my bracket', because I'm going to turn the game off the second that match is over, and I'm not going to pick it back up.
To feel good at the end of a match, I need to get at least 2 kills. 2 is a tie, and once I hit that, I can at least take a breath and calm down for the rest of the match — I put up a fight, if nothing else.
With tighter MMR, with more sweaty players, I'm not going to make it more than a single terrible match before I give up the game again. I'll go back to how it was back when ranks meant something; I'm going to stop playing for months at a time, only coming back when a new killer is dropped that interests me, and if I end up getting wrecked again I'm going to stop playing.
I don't want easy matches. I want SOME easy matches, and I want SOME matches where I have to sweat. I want to go from a match where I 4ked at 5 gens to one where, no, I didn't kill anyone — I might not have even managed to hook them — because I can ride the high from the 4k match to get over my own ass getting stomped. If I turn on the game, and get systematically dismantled right off the bat, every time, then I'm not going to want to play anymore. Case closed.
That said, I think there's a chance that BHVR will do a Ranked/Casual mode at some point. They know it's wanted, and it's been in the Survey's before. Just gotta wait to see if they can find a way to implement it without breaking half the game in the process.
The killer experience has become so frustrating. While you do have separate MMR per killer, it gets boosted massively for ever one when you hit a certain threshold. That means you're pretty much guaranteed sweaty matches no matter what killer you pick, even if you just wanna try one you've never played before and don't even have perks for. I never touch half of the roster just because I know I won't learn anything when taking them out.
I'M NOT CRAZY! Holy crap the vindication I feel knowing that they changed the mmr feels so nice. I noticed a change in the games I got a bit ago and I was so confused on why everything felt sweaty. I'ma be honest I refuse to play the game rn, its just an unfun sweat fest or a steamroll. Thank you for this video mate.
I wonder if streamers who play the game for dozens of hours a day find SBMMR bad, and those who play for an hour is so every so often have no problem with it.
I think the main issue is that it’s very binary how MMR changes – kills and escapes. But survivors can throw games and give unearned 4Ks, and good survivors can run the killer for 5 gens and die to NOED while selfish teammates leave. It should be based on your emblem result average, perhaps.
I agree in the ranked and unranked mode. If they had a DBDM style league of players and teams, it would further incentivise those players to only play for that reward. While everyone else plays casual elsewhere.
I agree but still feel like the builds wouldn't be varied enough. Usually beginners go with whatever they have and their builds are messy. Vets would simply run the meta. They could have extra bp for running non-meta perks or the less perks you equip, the bigger the bp multiplier. Things like that.
The fun side of dc penalty is when dedidaceted Servers are not responding
I play on EU servers so I don’t know if that makes any difference but solo queue has been pure garbage for months now. If someone isn’t killing themselves on hook at 5 gens I have to consider it a good game because it happens very often. I hardly ever get to escape, despite having over 5000 hours, getting all 5 gens done barely ever happens and it’s not through a lack of trying. Sometimes I bring stake out, hyperfocus, deja vu and distortion just so I can slam the gens and actually escape 1/8 games.
MMR should be more strict only for SWFs and Nurses/blights, let them enjoy comp dbd.
There's a very similar video to this one by "the boy unknown" only it's halo infinite. omg you even make the same points with halo 3. I'd give their video a watch too as it's humorous.
6:20 winning is more of a concept you determine not always the game. going 30 and 0 on cod is a win for me. idfc if the game says i lost. if i had good chases and 8 hook everyone, that's a win and everyone had an interesting match hopefully. it's how you look at the glass.
11:20 based.
Yay, theres now a slightly higher chance that as a 500h player i won't see p100 in every single lobby…
Nope, still seeing them every game.
I uninstalled I'm so burnt out and tired I'm solo q I have 4k hours and I seem to get teamed with new survivors I swear I had to bring distortion,calm spirit,left behind and windows just for a chance at hatch because my team get destroyed at three to four gens left which is frustrating I don't have many hours as killer as I do with survivor but every time I play killer I get the god damn navy seals it's so disparaging to play anymore so I just uninstalled chucky can't be a band aid for my "enjoyment" to go up
Its funny to see people with 1k+ hrs complaining they can't get easy matches against new players. lmfao only dbd. Everyone just wants a free win.
Quality content.
Couldn't agree more, and it's a large part of why I stopped playing. It was more fun when matches were random and every match turned out different. Now every match is a sweatfest, same perks, same killers, every match is stressful.
I hate it, I don't want to pretend I'm some super competitive esports (lmao) player. I don't find 'competitive' DBD interesting in the slightest because all the matches are the same. You see people like Otz being like "Ohhh did you see what they did there?!" like yeah, they bodyblocked to get their friend out because that's what they do every freaking game.
DBD used to be chaotic casual fun and now it's just.. sweaty, stressful, and boring.
I basically quit DbD because of MMR. I play Identity V now, which in my opinion, is a way better game than DbD ever will be. It has a normal ranked system, unranked, fun gamemodes and survivors are more than just skins. So I agree a lot, and I think it's time that BHVR took more from NetEase than them managing their mobile ports now.
MMR has made it difficult to enjoy the game and mess around with different builds or silly ones even, majority of the time I just go up against a super sweat stack so then I get frustrated go back to Blight and it's far less sweaty. BHVR needs to be more transparent about this and how it works instead of pointlessly being all cloak and dagger about everything, being transparent with your community always helps.
If they are gonna add a rank mode they should keep either the old rank system (20-1 ) or stay to what we have and maybe add like plat/diamond
And then just make the unrank mode which I have nothing to say about it 😅